Why NeoSmart software doesn't grant user to choose where to install it?

V@no

New Member
#1
Hello.

A simple question: why NeoSmart doesn't grant users to choose where they want install the software and forcibly install it on system drive?

That is not the way to do it, especially when SSD drives are slowly become mainstream, but not big enough to be used to install every single software on it, especially the software that would be used once-in-a-blue-moon...
Personally I found it very annoying.
 

JustinW

Super Moderator
Staff member
#2
Its been awhile since I've installed anything NST so don't know. Are you only getting this with EasyBCD beta? If that's the case I'm sure the final installer well give you the option.

If its not available in other NST software well... EasyBCD is portable. You can copy the contents to another location and continue to use EasyBCD after uninstalling. NST software doesn't require that much space on the drive any way. You should always have at least enough space to accomondate your OS/Programs and put your data elsewhere if you need to.
 

mqudsi

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
#3
EasyBCD is 3MiB. That's really not worth showing an extra screen during setup!
 
#4
I know this is a very old thread, but I just stumbled upon it. I am surprised at the answer. Good software should always give the user the choice of where to install it. Moreover, it should give the user the option of whether or not a Desktop shortcut should be installed (I know BCD does this), and where the Program Group shortcuts folder is stored under the Start Menu's programs listing.
 

mqudsi

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
#5
If the 3MiB really bother you guys, you can install EasyBCD, use it, uninstall it, and reinstall it whenever you need it again.

I promise not to charge you extra for the additional installs.
 

V@no

New Member
#6
It's not what we can or can't do, it's about how the software is made.
And yes, Coputer Guru, it's only 3mb, it's not even worth to be installed at all, I mean, it is portable after all, it runs fine if copy whole folder to a flash drive and start it on another computer, why bother with the installer in the first place...The only reason I can think of it has an installer is the additional commercial software (which is optional) it offers to install along with itself, that's about it...
As spamless says, it's a good practice to let user the options to choose from...

Don't get me wrong, I really do appreciate the software and respect what NeoSmart doing, just out of curiosity wanted to find out why there is this annoyance exists...


[edit]
I don't know why my other post was locked....
Don't start extra threads, ok?
my other post was about EasyBCD specifically, not about NeoSmart software in general as this post (not sure why it turned into EasyBCD specific discussion, I didn't even mentioned it :wink:).. And besides, these two posts have different questions...unless of course we are not allowed start two topics in one day or something, if that what you meant...

EasyBCD is portable. Its called copy/paste to another location and uninstall.
Well, perhaps we are understanding "portable" differently.
Portable is when you download a program, you start it and it does what supposed to without installing itself on the computer...
My question was: any plans to do such version?
[/edit]
 
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JustinW

Super Moderator
Staff member
#7
Again, EasyBCD is portable and I know it is cause that's how i've been using it. With 7-zip you don't even need to install it first. That portable enough for you? I was kind of learning towards NST software in general but Easy's about the only NST utility that can be portable considering what the other sys tools are made for (iReboot most certainly needs to be installed). From what I've heared HnS comes in a zip folder, right? Thats portable minus the files on the system when ran to make it work.

I'm sure CG could add the option in the installer easily if it really bothers you (he might even do that) but right now he's got to work on the program rather than the installer. When the final comes out that would be a good time to worry about this. Even if you could change the location in the installer it doesn't make a program portable. You're just relocating its install files.

The topics were related. In a very short period of time you had posted two threads with hints of making NST software portable. Instead of waiting around for one of us to reply you decided "hey let's start another thread" asking about portability. It seems to me you should have asked that question in the first place instead of bothering us with a complaint about an installer.

Now I've explained the process twice. You can either re-install, copy/paste/uinstall, or 7-zip the installer.
 

Terry60

Knows where his towel is.
Staff member
#8
I understand from CG that the install is a requirement from magazine publishers who bundle Easy along with selections of their favourite useful tools on free CD/DVD attachments, and who obviously rate their readers as clueless, needing everything done for them.
It does nothing apart from register itself in a sort of pseudo-install, and as Justin points out, more savvy users can copy it where they want, and "uninstall" it (deregister). Then it's completely portable.
I guess that that's the reason why it doesn't go to great lengths to make a sophisticated "where do you want me" addition to the install.
Most users interested enough to think about where they put their apps will be perfectly capable of managing it.
 

mqudsi

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
#9
Most users are used to getting their software in a form of an exe that they run, which then adds itself to the start menu (and possibly the desktop).

Portable means we'll have to distribute EasyBCD as a ZIP or RAR file. People don't always have ZIP and RAR correctly registered with a unzip/unrar program, and are unable to open the files.

EasyBCD is really meant to be as easy to use as possible. Download, Install, and Run is actually easier than Download and Run, believe it or not. It's just about what people are used to.

I could easily add a second screen to show install destination, but I really don't see it's an issue. In 3 years, you're the first that's asked for it. When you have such a simple alternative as easy as copy & pasting the files thereafter, *and* that no one else has missed this feature in literally millions of downloads...
 
#10
Its about convenience really. I think what V@ano and spamless are getting at here is that some users appreciate the convenience of downloading a program, running the installer, getting an option of where to install the program files to and/or put a shortcut on the desktop and start menu. Personally, I feel that if you went to all the effort of trying to make a program as convenient and easy to use as possible, you might as well go all the way, and allow the user to decide where to put the program he's installing, in my opinion. Obviously, this is a small feature and not that important. but its about what the users of the software want, and if you're writing software to make it as easy as possible for them, why hold back a feature that is commonly seen in program installers? Now, I'd say though the default install location should still of course be C:/Program and Files/NeoSmart/EasyBCD, but in case the user wanted to install it somewhere else (a partition where they have more space, for instance, or a partition where they like to install all their programs), such a feature could be valuable to the user.

Just my thoughts on the matter. :smile:
 

V@no

New Member
#11
Coolname007 provided excellent point about the installer, I have nothing to add to the subject..

Since my other post is locked, I'd like to say a few words related EasyBCD as portable. Even though 3mb is not that big in our days, believer or not there are a lot, and I mean A LOT of people still stuck on dialup, that 3mb vs 1.3mb (for portable zipped version) would free up 5-10 minutes of their downloading.. apparently that extra 1.7mb is the installer? - ouch.

Maybe...you could experiment and see how much demand a portable version would have vs the installer? :wink:
 
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mqudsi

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
#12
Actually, the installer is smaller than a .ZIP of EasyBCD's files. EasyBCD is 3MB *unzipped* and only 1.2MB as an exe. A .zip version of EasyBCD is 1.6MB.

The reason? The installer uses advanced heuristics to re-create duplicate files on extraction, and uses the LZMA2 compression algorithm.

I'm seriously considering adding a Installation Directory page to the setup, but a "portable" version is pretty much out of the question for all the reasons I have mentioned above.
 

mqudsi

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
#14
Unfortunately I cannot do it in the way you describe (adding it to the bottom of the page) without a lot of trouble. If it were possible, I'd have done so ages ago, no complaints or arguments from me!

The problem is that I'll have to add it as a separate page, and I did not want to increase the number of steps involved in installing EasyBCD.
 
#15
Unfortunately I cannot do it in the way you describe (adding it to the bottom of the page) without a lot of trouble. If it were possible, I'd have done so ages ago, no complaints or arguments from me!

The problem is that I'll have to add it as a separate page, and I did not want to increase the number of steps involved in installing EasyBCD.
What?? Why not? Looks like a matter of just adding an input field and a pushbutton to that particular dialog of the installer, and then connecting the pushbutton to a function which brings up an open-file dialog (which I'm sure they already have a built-in class for that, in the framework). If its as easy to create such things in .Net Framework as it is in QT, it should take little more than a few more lines of code...:wink:
 
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mqudsi

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
#16
The installer is not .NET, it's C++. And it has its own framework that works by means of pages, not controls.
 
#17
I cannot imagine that the framework would not offer a means of adding controls to a page.